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Omar Iqbal Khan
Registered User
(5/18/01 6:40 pm)
Need Desperate help
Hi all,
Pakistan is a third world country where Islam has been constitutionally adapted to legalize many non Islamic practices. Secularly elected governments decide about Islamic laws and authorize thier misuse.

Such an act was instituted some years ago in that country which has supported death sentence for a group of peaceful & highly educated citizens after decleing them non Muslims and who are now not even allowed to greet others in an Islamic way. So much so if they do so they are liable to several years imprisonment and even a death sentence.

What I ask you is not what you think about this group but whether you regard them as human beings or not and whether you think they have human rights. That is all.

Remember Germany:

In Germany they came first for the Communists, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist. Then they came for the Jews, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Jew. Then
they came for the trade unionists, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a trade unionist. Then they came for the Catholics, and I didn't speak up because I was a Protestant. Then they came for me, and by that time no one was left to speak up.
--Martin Niemoeller

A similar holocaust is going on in this country. Please click on the following link to read and see if you agree with it:

Please I ask you not to judge by your personal feelings but by what is right and what is wrong.

Remember it could happen to you, your father, your brother, your sister, your mother.

God protect us all.

Support one another and let's make this world a better place. Remember no religion supports force.

Your brother and friend in humanity,
Omar Khan

(5/21/01 8:05 am)
Re: Need Desperate help
Thanks for your note, Omar, and thanks for bringing up the issue.

Some random thoughts:

Ahmadis are certainly human beings and have whatever rights human beings have as such. Also, from what I understand of their treatment in Pakistan, I don't like it. I think it's bad.

There ought in concept to be some universal natural law limit on compulsion in matters of religion. I'm not sure just what that limit is. Certainly, though, if something seems wrong to me I ought somehow to be able to say so.

In Germany and many Western countries it's illegal to use Nazi symbols or the Nazi salute, to own a copy of Mein Kampf, etc., because Nazism is a very bad thing and the authorities want to guard against it. In Pakistan it's illegal for some people to use Islamic symbols or an Islamic greeting, to recite the Quran, etc., because the people and authorities have decided that orthodox Islam is a very good thing and they want to protect it. I expect enforcement is much less brutal in the West than in Pakistan, and that's certainly an important issue, but the real dispute between Western countries and UNESCO on the one hand, and Pakistan on the other, seems to be whether it's human rights or Islam that should be the fundamental authoritative view that deserves legal protection.

On that point I'm at odds with both sides. It seems to me though that today, in 2001, militant Islam is less of a threat to the world at large than human rights. The countries that back the human rights movement are more imperialistic and have a lot more money, H-bombs, cruise missiles, etc. Also, I think an intolerant Islamic regime is better than the intolerant PC regime at which the human rights movement aims. Islam is superior, I think, to human rights as a view of things because it better suits the nature of man and the world.

So I'd like to make some gesture on behalf of the Ahmadis but not one that would also be a gesture on behalf of the United Nations, liberal human rights, and so on. I'm not sure what would make sense.

Jim Kalb and

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